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Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Sun May 08, 2011 7:59 pm
by clanpowell
MKG. I really enjoyed your post. I agree with everything you said. I have another theory about religion as well. I think it is all to do with a couple of things.
Devolvement of responsibility (God's plan, forgiveness of sin, atonement for deeds carried out in a former life etc etc).
Most of all I think it's about an inate inability of humans to except that things just happen because they do. We seem to have this need to have an explanation for everything, when we run out of logical explanations we atribute it to some form of deity or spirituality. Be it evolution (how some people still think this is untrue astounds me) the begining of the universe.
The one thing that to me seems to overide it all is fear of death and it is my opinion that most religions, intentionally or not, play on that fear to get people to behave in a certain way. Good example is the turing up to confession, the the priest all your "sins" and you go to heaven be another Christian denomination and you'll go to hell. If that isn't fear mongering I don't know what is.

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Mon May 09, 2011 5:54 am
by chickenchargrill
Very interesting thread this.

There's a need to belong to something too, with religion and such. I'm a kind-of Christian, though the 'god' I believe in is more like Brahman, neti neti (not this, not that). The school my girls go to isn't denominational, yet does have strong links with the local CofE church.

To be honest, my girls are 7 and 5, I wouldn't care what they came back and starting chanting or praying. They're kids, they need to find a way to make up their own minds about things and I'll support them in that and I use it to teach them. I do not force my own beliefs on them, although they know what I believe, they know their step-dad is Catholic and their Dad is an atheist. I encourage them to question and to find out more about what others believe. They know a little about Islam, about Hinduism, about modern witches... anything else they want to find out about I encourage. I think that's important and I would find it very wrong to do otherwise. I teach my kids to accept people, how can I do that of I then made them feel wrong for believing something I didn't?

The only thing I failed at was getting so angry last week at the people trying to stop fellow Muslims from voting because it was shirk. Eleanor (my 5-year-old) saw some of the posters around here and asked about them, I just said they were put up by idiots and to ignore them.

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Mon May 09, 2011 6:12 am
by chickenchargrill
Oh, and I know it was a while since the original post, but if my kids wanted to say 'grace' I would suggest a toast instead to those involved in making the meal possible.

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Mon May 09, 2011 9:19 am
by Susie
MKG wrote: In spite of that, MOST religions teach much the same thing - something to which I can have no objection (you know the stuff - respect, tolerance, value of life etc.). But ALL followers of ANY religion, whether they think it or not (it's axiomatic), develop huge blind spots. Those spots, depending upon your viewpoint and your beliefs, are variously termed faith, dogma or hypocrisy (or, if you take things back far enough, righteousness. That one caused a lot of trouble). To me, they're all the same thing.
Well, I was non-religious much of my life and now I am a Happy Pagan. I'm not sure I've developed any additional blind spots and indeed my IQ seems to be at the level it was at before (not that it was much to boast about then :wink: ) but if someone wants to give me a heads up of where righteousness might be affecting my worldview I'll be happy to keep an eye out.

Also wanted to link Aubade because the great motheaten musical brocade bit seems pertinent. Shame no-one ever invited poor old Philip to any nice Sabbat celebrations to take his mind off things. JOKING. (Although actually he might have enjoyed it).

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Mon May 09, 2011 4:26 pm
by oldjerry
surely the essence of a blind spot is that ya can't see it.... anyhow nice link to Larkin,havent read any of that since pontious was a pilot. Seem to remember he lived in Hull,so you cant blame him for being a tad hacked off.

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Wed May 11, 2011 7:47 am
by Keaniebean
Ok a while since the thread started but I've been having some ' drag myself away from the computer time' :wink:

I can totoally sympathise with you Mrs F. I myself am a practising Hedgewitch although I was brought up as a very strict Roman Catholic. I went to RC schools, confessions, masses every Sunday and did the whole fish on Friday thing, the whole kit and kaboodle I always had an interest in 'other' things, at the time I just never knew they fell under the name of Paganism. I choose not to be confirmed at 15 and finally found my path at the age of 25 give or take.

Sophie has the advantage that I never did in that you are making her aware that other religions exist and you are giving her the freedom to choose, but ultimately it will be her choice. I have sent both my children to a church school and even though i hate the fact that they come home 'preaching' to me (especially my 6 year old), I know that in time they will find their own way the same as I did. Of course I hope that it will be the same way that I chose but I cannot guarantee it.

I do think that it is more to do with her age as my 11 year old used to do the same, yet now she is asking more questions about what I believe and browsing my bookshelf at all the healing, crystal, reflexology, tarot, spell and goddess books I have accumulated.

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Thu May 12, 2011 12:07 pm
by mrsflibble
I am wondering, would I seem impertinent if I called the local gurudwara and asked if we could sit in on a service?
should I just call and give it a go? I'm embarrassed lol.
she's interested in seeing various religious practises and is most interested in sikhism at the moment (cos of the turbans I think lol).

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Thu May 12, 2011 12:29 pm
by chickenchargrill
Not at all! Especially if you explained the reason for it. Adeline's had a tour and a chat at our local temple, they were very nice and even gave her some yummy mithai.

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Fri May 13, 2011 8:19 am
by mrsflibble
after posting yeatrday I came to the conclusion that if you don't ask, you don't get!!

I, Emma Oliver, Terrified of talking to people on phones or asking for help, have arranged for us to visit the local gurudwara and have sophie's questions answered by the temple warden who is going to open it up and give us a personal tour!!!! how cool is that?!???!

this is the first of many trips I intend to take with her. the next project she chooses, I'll look into visits for that too.

open mindedness FTW. friendly sikh gentleman called Jassel FTW too lol.

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Fri May 13, 2011 11:25 am
by Helsbells
Excellent! How exciting, good for you MrsF, you are very brave.

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Fri May 13, 2011 11:47 am
by chickenchargrill
Go Mrs F! Let us know how it goes x

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Sat Sep 24, 2011 2:09 pm
by celticmyth
Just found this thread......So mrs. did the visit go? is your daughter still saying grace or moved past that stage?

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2011 5:04 pm
by demi
hi guys, iv just found this thread too.

personally i dont think religion should have any place in schools. belief is a personal choice and it should be something practiced, if you wish to do so at all, in your own time.

im athiest, as are my perent, but i went through phases during my teenage years trying to understand the world ( as i think everyone does). i started off wiccan, then pagen, then buddhist ,then athiest and finally i have come to understand the world and everything now makes sence in my head. i feel a sence of enlightenment and inner peace with myself that my understanding and realisation gives me.

i dont want my kids brainwashed in school. they can choose on their own what they want to belive, like my parents did with me. i know they will come to understand the world in their own time, they dont need someone preaching to them, trying to scare them into believing somthing they may not agree with.
school is for learning, educating, so that they can go out into the world with the best possible start, to have the option the choose their career path. religion is personal choice, there is no need to practice it in schools, it has nothing to do with learning a skill and getting a job in the real world. it should be strictly extra carricular. besides, it just gives the kids another reason for social devision, leading to bulling and potentially terrorism, just look at Irland, never mind the middle east!

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:52 pm
by Silver Ether
I always pointed out that I believe different things .... My boy went to Sunday school his choice at about 6 yrs it was to join in with his friend ... and when he talked about christian stuff I would listen and tell him my side and ask him to think and make up his own mind. I did attend a couple of events with him carol service and mothers day but told him I would not join in with anything praising Jesus and God as its not my way and there to support him ... he was fine with that then some time later he said He didn't want to go anymore as it was shit ... trying not to laugh at his expressive way I said thats fine .. but he also said he thought my was shit ... so shrugged my shoulders and let him get on with it ... as long as he causes no harm whats the problem ... I don't think he follows any path at the moment 29yrs ... he doesn't pass a lot of comment of spirituality other than looking with eyes of someone gaining knowledge ...

So What about you let Sophie say what she wants and then you add yours ?

and religion should be kept out of school it causes so much bother and its got nothing to do with any one what path your on.

Re: Please help me Pagan Parents!!!

Posted: Wed May 16, 2012 8:47 pm
by wolfhazel
I have the same problem with my eldest who is nearing 4 and her childminder insists she bless her food and pre-school had her coming home telling me about Jesus being selotaped to the cross (gotta giggle at that one)

I spoke to some other Pagan parents about the issue and here's some of the guidance I got...

As for the blessing of food, as a Pagan you can still bless the food in a kind of blessed be way, or give thanks in general to the rain for watering the plants and the sun etc. Some people I know say "rubadubdub thanks for my grub" for all she knows you can be thanking yourself? With my daughter I do this now I just say thank mummy for cooking the food which we couldn't have without the sun and the rain and the earth etc. Sometimes I remind her that different people do different things so some bless their food and others don't and she can do as she chooses.

As for the school teaching Christianity etc. I have just accepted that this is going to happen and I will when she comes home I will show an interest in what she has learned and talk about how lots of people have different beliefs etc. I'm also engaging her in nature and the environment more, getting her to grow her own tomato plant etc and she joins me in yoga etc so that I can teach her my spirituality and moral code as well and then when the time comes, she can make her own mind up with an awareness of all the different beliefs out there.

Hope my ramblings help some way or another, inevitably as with most parenting follow your gut it's usually right xx