Does organic veg really taste better ?

[Odsox]

Or is it a myth ?

I always supposed that organically grown veg must taste better as it's a totally natural product, but never really questioned that assumption.
I'm not talking about pesticides here, just organically grown in natural soil using natural fertilisers.

Here's the thing, last year I tried growing tomatoes hydroponically, which was a bit of a failure as the toms got badly blighted.
Not the fault of the hydroponic system but because my greenhouse leaked like a sieve and all my tomatoes got blighted through the dampness.

This year I am trying again with the hydroponics unit in the nice dry conservatory and it is planted with Tigerella tomatoes, with more Tigerella planted out in my small dry greenhouse. The greenhouse ones are planted in the border soil which was rejuvenated with chicken manure pellets and are now being fertilised with comfrey tea. The hydroponics ones are fed with pure spring water and a mixture of totally inorganic chemicals.

Last weekend we did a taste test and I was totally gobsmacked to find that the hydro ones were far and away more tasty that the organic ones, in fact the organic ones were pretty much tasteless. I was not expecting that.

I am rebuilding my large greenhouse this year and had been dithering as to whether it would make sense to convert it to large scale hydroponics at the same time. I have made up my mind and that's exactly what I'm going to do, so next year I shall have fun finding out just what plants you can grow hydroponically and how they compare both taste wise and crop yield.

[Millymollymandy]

When you say organic, do you mean they start as organic seeds or that you just grow them organically?

I don't know about tasting better but the organic Gardeners' Delight and two peppers, orange and purple, which I bought from a garden centre, aren't growing well at all compared to non organic ones (grown in an organic way). I wouldn't bother touching organic veg again as they only produce half as much fruit as a non organic plant/seed AND it cost me more.

[Odsox]

When you say organic, do you mean they start as organic seeds or that you just grow them organically?

Not organic seed, just ordinary bought seed, but then grown organically in the greenhouse.

I couldn't say about shop bought inorganic/organic as I can't honestly remember when I last bought some .. many years ago now.
If I don't grow it, I don't eat it.

[ina]

It all depends... On so many things! Quality of the plant, if you've bought it - doesn't matter whether organic or not, if it's not been produced to a high standard, it can only produce rubbish. On the soil, if you grow in it - not just on the fertiliser you apply. On water availability. On sun exposure. And then, even two carrots of the same variety, grown in the same field, right next to each other, can be massively different (carrots seem to be particularly prone to that). I've had tasteless organic veg, and tasty non-organic. (There's a lot of what I call "industrial organic" around, too - conventional without some of the chemicals... Which usually tastes like most industrially produced food.) So no, it doesn't always taste better. (Would be too easy, wouldn't it! )

[Peggy Sue]

The theory goes that organic veg (not forced by fertilisers) has a greater dry matter (less water) so should have a stronger taste- so in theory hydroponics should be rubbish taste so there goes that theory!!

What I have noticed big time is the diffference in taste between shop and mine (grown on muck not fertiliser)- especially broccoli, carrots and swede (to the point where the swede is overpowering alone!). Maybe that is time delay and storage rather than the growing practice? Or all thoses other things Ina mentioned.

Since I have ample access to horse manure thats free, even if it tasted worse I'd have to go with the free stuff out of principle

[ina]

I've sometimes had the feeling that you can overdo the chicken manure bit, too - I use that pelleted stuff, when I can't get "proper" manure, and had the impression that it didn't improve the flavour... But that's just a subjective impression, no proper comparison done!

[contadina]

The biggest factor on taste is freshness, so the closer you harvest to eating it should provide the best taste. Nothing is going to beat homegrown.

I don't grow organically for taste, I do it because I don't want to damage flora or fauna and I don't want to ingest chemicals. The government-funded study in the news this week which said there were no health benefits from eating organic conveniently didn't look at pesticides, so completely missed the point of why most people choose organic.

[Peggy Sue]

The government-funded study in the news this week which said there were no health benefits from eating organic conveniently didn't look at pesticides, so completely missed the point of why most people choose organic.

You know what they say about statistics...

[ina]

You know what they say about statistics...

And about the FSA!!!

[Cheezy]

The report has been brought out because the government is worried about the huge increase in demand for organic veg. With the increase in population and loss of land we are more and more reliant on imported veg. Production efficency of organic veg is much lower than intensive chemical, so they are trying to dampen the demand for organic.

What matters is buying local, seasonal veg (Oh God here he goes again! ). Supporting local farmers be they organic or otherwise. On taste, what usually makes a difference is eating the veg as fresh as possible, quiet a lot of veggies loose "fresh" taste in the first couple of hours (and in some cases "goodness"), so growing your own is the only answer there.

How can a Peruvian organic asperagus a) taste better, b) have more vitimins and minerals, c) be sustainable, compared with either my own , or the local ones delivered with our milk! (which happened to be organic)

[contadino]

The report has been brought out because the government is worried about the huge increase in demand for organic veg. With the increase in population and loss of land we are more and more reliant on imported veg. Production efficency of organic veg is much lower than intensive chemical, so they are trying to dampen the demand for organic.

What matters is buying local, seasonal veg (Oh God here he goes again! ). Supporting local farmers be they organic or otherwise. On taste, what usually makes a difference is eating the veg as fresh as possible, quiet a lot of veggies loose "fresh" taste in the first couple of hours (and in some cases "goodness"), so growing your own is the only answer there.

How can a Peruvian organic asperagus a) taste better, b) have more vitimins and minerals, c) be sustainable, compared with either my own , or the local ones delivered with our milk! (which happened to be organic)

You're quite right, except that since the UK has started suffering financially, demand for organic produce has fallen - quite significantly. The report was, perhaps, commissioned before the slump, but IMO before it was written the report was given the remit to support the case for GMO & intensive agriculture.

Any fool can say that the nutrient content of organic/non-organic produce is the same at the time of harvest, but of course that doesn't mean that fruit & veg saturated with pesticides & herbicides are as good for you as organic produce.

[ina]

The report has been brought out because the government is worried about the huge increase in demand for organic veg. With the increase in population and loss of land we are more and more reliant on imported veg. Production efficency of organic veg is much lower than intensive chemical, so they are trying to dampen the demand for organic.

Well, they obviously still haven't woken up to the fact that intensive chemical doesn't have a long term future, anyway, seeing that we are running out of the fuel necessary for that style of production... What they really should be doing is invest in research to improve sustainable, low impact and low energy agriculture (I wouldn't just call it organic). Instead, they are spreading half truths, and suppressing some of their own research (e.g. the work that found out about all the pesticide residues on food).

[Peggy Sue]

Oh I'll second all of that!

Shame is they use our tax payers money to pay the researchers to write reports to favour whatever they feel is to their advantage and call it their (well paid) job! (Rant over with now)

So interestingly this 'organic or not' debate goes on at every allotment when in fact whatever happens just producing from an allotment has GOT to be better than shipped stuff- EVEN if its had chemcials they are likely only to be used as required and therefore in smaller quantities....and not industrial strength in many cases.

The time thing is interesting- I like to rush stuff to the table and don't keep stuff other than stored onions/garlic/pumpkins for the winter. I give away alot of excess crops and often ask people a week later if they enjoyed it and they still haven't cooked it- what are they waiting for!!!

I wonder if this original experiment with hydroponics is much the same for all veg or whether tomatoes are particularly suited- would chillis for example be as strong?

[red]

nah i dont think organic veg tastes better. but as already said. thats not the point.


home grown - varieties you like - fresh as in only a couple of minutes old - veg taste lovely.

[Cheezy]

nah i dont think organic veg tastes better. but as already said. thats not the point.


home grown - varieties you like - fresh as in only a couple of minutes old - veg taste lovely.

Exactly, the other bit I was going to say, but rudely got interupted by my boss at work (Don't these people realise I've got a soap box to stand on, and that I only go to work so that I can pay the mortgage )

Is that a lot of commercially available crops, INCLUDING organic have been bred for supermarkets, ie uniformity, colour ,size and bloody shelf life, and have absolutely no interest about flavour or "goodness". Some organics are chosen by the supplier because they will show good disease resistence, again nothing to do with flavour or nutrients.
Look at tomatoes, the ones you buy (unless your Contadino in lovely Italy) have virtually no flavour and have been shown to have less nutrients because they are grown intensively, under artifical light. Any wonder they taste of water, it's the vegetable equivalent of battery chickens. I'm growing the heritage Brandywine in the green house, it's a fantastic small beef tomato great flavour, but bloody awkward, low yield, gets blight at the drop of a hat, needs a good summer, why bother , cos it's a challenge and it tastes like tommie should. (had my first fresh tomato pasta dish last night , a mix of G Delight, Black Krim and Cour de Blu put in at the end so only warmed through, with anchovies, basil ,garlic,broad beans wonderful)
Strawberries are the classic example, In Britain we have the best strawberries because they suit our climate ie OUTSIDE, not stuck in polytunnels in Spain.When things grow slowly they will take on more flavour. My favourite that I grow is "Cambridge Favourite". It lasts approx 36 hours after picking before it goes a funny colour. Still tastes intensely strawberry. But obviously this low shelf life means we get bloody Elsanta instead, which look nice ,taste sh*te.

Takes a bow and steps off box