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The reason that Spanish Flu (the epidemic in 1918) killed so many young people is because the strain of flu triggers the immune system to attack it in such a way that those with the strongest immune system will actually be killed by their own reaction (does that make sense?) So the weak, elderly and the young would survive.

It would appear that the people coming into the UK with swine flu don't know they have it until a few days after getting home, when the symptoms kick in.

I want to know why it took the WHO (or the Mexican health authorities) so long to inform tourists of the outbreak, they could have cancelled had they known the outbreak was so prevalent, even before their trip.

Having said that.... it would appear that it isn't as dangerous as originally feared.

Annpan wrote:The reason that Spanish Flu (the epidemic in 1918) killed so many young people is because the strain of flu triggers the immune system to attack it in such a way that those with the strongest immune system will actually be killed by their own reaction (does that make sense?) So the weak, elderly and the young would survive.

I did a research paper regarding the 1918 Spanish Flu. It wasn't a naturally occuring strain, it was weaponized. That is why it killed so many people. Do a little bit of digging, and you'll easily confirm that the outbreak started on a military base. That's as much as I'm going to say about that, and if anyone is interested, they can look into it themselves.

wow Vajk, thats pretty dangerous thing to say, it killed millions...
If anyone has said this before, i'm sorry, but i'm not gonna read through the last 3 months of posts:
-1, keep the numbers in proportion 26000 people is not even 1% of the worlds population, although the increase is exponentiel.
-2 the last report i read, this Swine Flu strain (A) has a mortality rate of 0.1%, compared to 0.4% for normal flu, and 60% for bird flu, this is not bird flu, it is a pretty hard hitting flu, yes, but it is no where as lethal as what is being banded around by the press.
We should all get on with our lives, don't waste money on ineffective masks... and don't lock your doors against everyone with a big red cross painted on it...

Dangerous?

Mmm hmm.

I’ve heard that the truth is indeed dangerous.

I’ve also heard that it is unacceptable to be ‘right’ too soon. ;)

Historically it was ‘Indian policy’ to give/trade the natives blankets infected with smallpox and other plagues that had very little effect upon the Europeans (they had a built up resistance to the diseases) but it decimated whole tribes.

The Spanish flu wasn’t some freak accident of nature. It was being researched as a bioweapon, and it got out of control. Funny coincidence that it started on a military base during WWI… hmm…

Anyway…

‘Swine Flu’, H1N1 is also not natural. Neither is ‘Bird Flu, which is H5N1. It’s bioengineered. This was proven from inspection down in Mexico from where it theoretically originates.

As I said, I’m not going to ‘argue’ this, I just posted the comment because I read the post about the Spanish Flu and just tried to clarify. I’m here to talk about PLANTS! :D

Did you hear about the tainted vaccine that was sent from Baxter labs a few months ago that was tainted with LIVE bird flu, and it killed the ferrets they tested it on?

Probably not.

Why? Because the story on it on Reuters and the AP was killed almost immediately after it was released, and then deleted from the archives. DELETED. It was there, I read it with my own eyes. As in, it was published, and then wiped from the site, and when asked about it, they denied ever publishing it.

Now… why would they do that?

Thank God that Mike Adams (The health ranger) over at naturalnews.com covered the story or no one would have ever heard about it.

You want to read something that will keep you up at night? Go here:

http://www.naturalnews.com/bird_flu.html

This one is good too, it’s from March

Vaccines as Biological Weapons? Live Avian Flu Virus Placed in Baxter Vaccine Materials Sent to 18 Countries:
http://www.naturalnews.com/025760_pande ... virus.html

And you are correct about H1N1, it’s NOT a big deal at all. But you are meant to THINK it is. Think how you boil a frog. Toss a frog in hot water, frog jumps out. Increase the temp slowly, frog stays in and gets cooked. Something to think about. If people aren’t convinced that there’s something terribly, terribly wrong with the world around us and our stewardship of the planet as a species, then no amount of conversation and logic from me or anyone else is going to change their minds.

Less than 200 people have died thus far from the ‘Swine Flu’, and yet the WHO puts as at the first PANDEMIC level in 41 YEARS.

In contrast, 35,000 people a YEAR die from normal flu, and no one blinks an eye.

200 vs 35,000… hmm… (does the math), yep, it’s B.S.

One final point…

The question ye must ask is not: ‘Are’ these things man made?

The question you must ask is ‘WHY’ are these things man made?

Then, you might get somewhere. ;)

And wolfsong is absolutely correct. Don't disrupt your lives over this. (Swine Flu) This too shall pass.

Common sense and logic are your best defense against Swine Flu. Leave the mask at home.

Vajk wrote:
And you are correct about H1N1, it’s NOT a big deal at all. But you are meant to THINK it is. Think how you boil a frog. Toss a frog in hot water, frog jumps out. Increase the temp slowly, frog stays in and gets cooked. Something to think about.

I have felt this from the start. I have wondered why the media are pushing it constantly and why it is made out to be such a threat. Usually, when the media make a mountain out of a molehill it's because there's not much happening in the news - nobody's been murdered, the politicians haven't been caught doing anything they shouldn't, etc. But right now there's loads for the 'news' people to tell us about. So why are they going on about H1N1? You say it's not a big deal but we are meant to THINK it is. But WHY are we meant to THINK it is? What's going on that that we don't know about that make this a good distraction story? I feel that by not seeing this as a major thing, I am missing a different major thing IYSWIM. Or should I get off my lazy butt and read what's on those links you offered?

Vajk:

Vajk's article wrote:It's not an unreasonable question to ask: Could world governments, spooked by the prospect of radical climate change caused by over-population of the planet, have assembled a super-secret task force to engineer and distribute a super virulent strain of influenza designed to "correct" the human population (and institute global Martial Law)?

Yes, because they would have made a better effort at it, and also they don't really care about the environment...

also, a plausible reason why it has so many different types of flu in it is the replication process of the virus, and that the second generation of virus can have data from the 2 different parent viruses, the mexican pig farms are horrible incubators for disease anyway, it wouldn't be that difficult for two to combine, and then combine again with bird flu in a nearby poultry factory.

Rosendula wrote: Usually, when the media make a mountain out of a molehill it's because there's not much happening in the news - nobody's been murdered, the politicians haven't been caught doing anything they shouldn't, etc. But right now there's loads for the 'news' people to tell us about. So why are they going on about H1N1?

The fleet street vultures are very good at this, a percievable global pandemic that 'may' wipe out millions of people is any hacks wet dream, they weren't going to let this one go, despite it being just a strain of flu that hit young people harder than older people

Oh and hey, i swear i didn't read this article before posting,

The headlines today tell of the first person in Britain killed by swine flu. The second line tells us that the person was already in hospital being treated for underlying conditions. Scaremongering or what!

Milims wrote:The headlines today tell of the first person in Britain killed by swine flu. The second line tells us that the person was already in hospital being treated for underlying conditions. Scaremongering or what!

Indeed... The BBC seem to be choosing their word carefully

The first person in Europe to die after being diagnosed with swine flu

For all we know she had also been diagnosed with an ingrowing toenail... doesn't mean it was the thing that killed her.

Annpan wrote:

Milims wrote:The headlines today tell of the first person in Britain killed by swine flu. The second line tells us that the person was already in hospital being treated for underlying conditions. Scaremongering or what!

Indeed... The BBC seem to be choosing their word carefully

The first person in Europe to die after being diagnosed with swine flu

For all we know she had also been diagnosed with an ingrowing toenail... doesn't mean it was the thing that killed her.

Exactly. And even if it was what killed her, it doesn't mean it's a 'Pandemic'.

Found this parody that I found kinda funny. It's only funny if you are up on world events enough to know WHO (no pun intended), the people in the picture are.

If you don't know who they are, it's not so funny. If you do, it's frickin' hilarious.

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p182 ... _Final.jpg

Post Scriptum: Mandatory 'flu' vaccinations are coming to a country near you. You can agree or disagree. Wait and see. ;)

Vajk wrote:

Annpan wrote:
Exactly. And even if it was what killed her, it doesn't mean it's a 'Pandemic'.

Point of technicality: A "pandemic" is not defined by the death toll, its defined by the rate at which a new disease spreads. A virus could be completely non-lethal, and if it spread fast enough it could still be called a pandemic.

Ellendra wrote:

Vajk wrote:

Annpan wrote:
Exactly. And even if it was what killed her, it doesn't mean it's a 'Pandemic'.

Point of technicality: A "pandemic" is not defined by the death toll, its defined by the rate at which a new disease spreads. A virus could be completely non-lethal, and if it spread fast enough it could still be called a pandemic.

Correct. But that is not how it is being portrayed in the media.

Is the media saying "This has spread to x number of countries, and thus, is being declared a 'pandemic' due the area of spread, but individuals have little to worry about."?

No. They are fear mongering.

The first 'Pandemic' in 41 years.

But as I said, I'm here to research, teach, and learn about plants, and thus, I remove myself from further comment upon this topic unless directly asked.

What you think or I think about it really means nothing. What will happen will happen, regardless, and I guess we'll all see soon enough, won't we. ;)

The only things amiss in this whole situation are irresponsible reportage and idiotic bureaucracy.

We have a new virus. It's already known to be less dangerous than ordinary flu (which no-one worries about). Ordinary flu has been pandemic for years. So-called "swine flu" (although its origin still hasn't been identified) is now pandemic - and, in WHO terms, that means only that the virus is passing from person to person in at least two of the six WHO regions. The word "pandemic" carries no hidden meanings or implied threats. The common cold is pandemic.

For the vast majority of people in this country there will already be a degree of immunity (because the new virus has a similar shape to that of ordinary flu). If you're (if I remember correctly) 58 or over, you will have a much greater degree of immunity because you'll have been exposed to a very similarly-shaped virus in the early 50s.

The symtoms of "swine flu" are, for all intents and purposes, identical to those of ordinary flu. So - this year I might get flu, just like last year I might have got flu - and the year before and the year before that. This year, it might be "swine flu". So what?

And, without wishing to cause any offence, flu viruses (well, any old virus really) need no artificial weaponising - they're quite capable of mutating all by themselves, and they do, and they do it often.

We have very short memories, don't we? Whatever happened to BSE (which has still not been connected to KJD)? Where has "bird flu" gone? Non-events - but the newspapers and politicians love 'em. Distracts us from what's really important, you see.

Mike

The only thing I'm worried about is OH is on immune suppressants in order for his steroids to work at a low dose... quite frankly even a common cold could be dangerous

MKG wrote:We have very short memories, don't we? Whatever happened to BSE (which has still not been connected to KJD)? Where has "bird flu" gone? Non-events - but the newspapers and politicians love 'em. Distracts us from what's really important, you see.

Mike

I'd already forgotten about 'swine' flu as I don't watch news very often but I wonder whatever happened to SARS or whatever it was called?

What I'd really like to know is what was this last winter's flu called - it really was a different kind of flu that I've never had before, and was very unpleasant. That was an epidemic in France but no-one gave it a name.

I've read a few of the posts on here re swine flu but not enough to pick holes in them all but my take on it is this. The reason the WHO didn't call a pandemic sooner is because western democrecies put preassure on the WHO to delay so that it wouldn't panic the markets into freefall. Secondly if you look at the levels of a pandemic it goes from 1 to 6 with specific trigger levels. Why were these not followed for level 6... see above theory.

Thirdly the uk is only testing cases of "suspected " swine flue if 1, you have been to / returned from mexico in the last 7 days or secondly you have close contact with someone who has returned tfrom mexico. In other words they are not looking for the total number of cases becuse if they did test every case then the cost would be astronomical... hey someone has to pay, and secondly the "real number" would be far worse and more scary. It is estimated that there will be at least 2300+ cases in the UK if evey one was tested.

What to do to prepare yourself and family.

Basic hygene which very manuy people don't do. Wash hands and hard surfaces with anti bacterial cleaner. You can buy the pocket / belt clip size alcohl gels for £2.15 from a good medical supplier or go to asda and get the similar thing for 47p.

Stockpile essential supplies such as food, water, Medicines, first aid supplies etc. Have an alternative fuel supply for cooking and also be aware of local "free food" such as hedgerow suppers etc.

Be aware that if this kicks off in the way many are expecting it to then people will soon be desperate and if you have prepared then you WILL have things that others want so the next step is being prepared to defend what is yours. How you do this is up to you and i'm not going to tell you how i will do it on a public forum. Surfice to say if you know me you'll know better than try,lol.
This may be seen as scaremongering but what would you do without fuel in your car? That will never happen fuel will always be available... you think so? Remeber back in 2001 when the tanker drivers went on strike....... np fuel, no lorries to deliver food to the shops, no food in the shops, shops close in 3 days, sooner if panic buying happens.

Suppose key workers go down with the swine flu. What would you do say if the local power company couldn't generate electricity, that's ok you have candles and tilly lamps etc, where are they, can you put your hands on them right now blindfolded because you will be in dark sometime. Even if you can water companies rely on power to purify and pump water out.......

See where this is going... As a basic exercise put down on paper a flow diagram and say for instance NO ELECTRIC in the middle. branch off from there what you would do for say cooking and follow that to it's logical conclusion. Then do the same for water, medicines etc. It will surprise and maybe shock you into doing something to prepare.

Sorry if it's a long post but when the shit hits the fan you don't want to be splattered.....