Selfsufficientish.com

trying again as my other thread didn't get many takers and i suspect the reason is that some may think they are just for hippy tree huggers. so, is that it? i must admit to thinking it may be slightly the case but i woudn't mind a bit of tree hugging as long as it's interspersed with some nitty gritty.
so, tree hugging or nitty gritty, whadyathink?

I would love to do one, but time and ££ make it practically impossible. Till that magic day I am hitting up my library and occasionally buying the books, surfing the many videos on internet and working it out as I go along.

Might try and do an intro day over the summer, as much to meet people who are interested too, as for what can be learnt and shared.

As for hippy tree huggers, dont think it is any more than trying to feed/fend for yourself without Big Brothers' interference. Not sure if I want my garden to be quite as wild and random looking as some of the videos I have seen, but I whole heartedly support the ethos and goals etc. Eventually I will find a balance that works for my life [well maybe] and feels right. Suspect it will have a lot of the ethics etc from Permaculture, but they seem to pop up in lots of places worded differently anyway.

hi sarah, yes it can be expensive and you kind of think how many books you could also buy with the money and there is also such a body of material to cover, maybe they don't go over stuff that interests you in particular. I was comparing prices on the main side of international vs uk based ones and it seems international ones are way cheaper. greece being the cheapest at 350 euros and free camping (plus air fare of course). and of course its a bonus that the weather is gauranteed to be good.
i also watched some videos and i think that some are extremely tree hugging like

Dear Safronsue,

Don't know if you've tried these but they're pretty sensible and have links to lots of other permaculture sites,

http://www.spiralseed.co.uk/

Love and Peace
Jim

Unfortunately the nearest course to me is about 300 miles south (or it was the last time I looked!) otherwise I'd have done it too.

Is it Spiralseed that ex-members of Crass started?

that looks like a very interesting site and i study it later. i would only be interested in courses in greece really though. thanks for the heads up

safronsue wrote:trying again as my other thread didn't get many takers and i suspect the reason is that some may think they are just for hippy tree huggers. so, is that it? i must admit to thinking it may be slightly the case but i woudn't mind a bit of tree hugging as long as it's interspersed with some nitty gritty.
so, tree hugging or nitty gritty, whadyathink?

Not at all... I've done the "Introduction to Permaculture" course and it was quite good, but I've never had the time / money for the full PDC. Exactly what the courses are like does depend quite a lot on the instructor, and probably on the other students as well, but permaculture can be a pretty nitty gritty kinda thing. If you can find a good teacher, it can be extremely practical and down-to-earth, with very little tree-hugging required. Lots of maps, charts, diagrams, and plans, but very little tree-hugging...

As for the idea of going international to keep the costs down... The thing about permaculture is that whilst the principles are universal, the actual implementation details are often extremely location-specific, and it can be difficult to see how to apply them somewhere if you've learnt them in a very different environment. I'd say you'll probably get far more out of it if you can find a course somewhere that's as much like your own location as possible.

Ah safron Sue, you and I both share this odd feeling that by being green we are turning into Hippies......

Actually I am coming to realise rather late in the day that they had much of it spot on.

This drinking herbal Tea and smoothies with Brown Flax seeds in has turned me queer I reckon ( in the old fashioned sence not in a derisory manner)

I did the Forest Gardening cource last year at Dartington in Devon and it was excellent, a number of people from Italy and Greece attended.

For a start I would get on some Web site or another and just visit as many sites as you can for tours etc, you'll get more out of it locally if you can do this I reckon, the book stuff you can learn from a book, but nothing beats seeing, tasting and smelling what it is you want.

Oh and build a composting Toilet right away.

exactly dunc, locality is key. the altitude we have here does make for extreme conditions but the course i have in mind has similar summer temps. oh really when you start to think there are just so many variables, unless its actually in your garden how similar can it be?

ooops excuse me, just off to build a composting loo
Happy may!

Dear Greenaura,

Yes it is,

Love and Peace
Jim

I was involved with a permaculture group about 20 years ago and in particular with another guy who was a permaculture designer. He was an architect and very good at ecological building design but when it came to gardening he was hopeless because he had permaculture theories but no real understanding of plants. I was very interested in the principles but when it came to the practice it was clear that few had a clue, because before you could be a good permaculture garden designer, you first had to be a good garden designer or at least a good gardener.
This and the fact that I always got the feeling that it was a bit like pyramid selling, you pay for this expensive course with the carrot that you then become a qualified permaculture designer and can then officially run expensive courses yourself and so on. This stuck in my throat, I think knowledge like this should be shared and distributed as freely and cheaply as possible.
I'd suggest, as others have, reading a book on the principles (they are not complicated or difficult) and then using the internet, Utube, etc. You might not get the buzz as you do in attending a course but it will be a lot cheaper and you can focus on what you are interested in. As I say you can't be a good permaculture designer unless you are knowledgeable in a particular area already.

grahamhobbs wrote:This and the fact that I always got the feeling that it was a bit like pyramid selling, you pay for this expensive course with the carrot that you then become a qualified permaculture designer and can then officially run expensive courses yourself and so on.

Yeah, I have to say I've noticed that aspect too...