Any home edders out there?

[wigan pixie]

I've enjoyed reading this thread. My boy is 9 and has never been to school, mainly because I don't agree with the current 'one size fits all' education system, which my sister (who was a head teacher then) continually complained about. Unfortunately, despite her growing unease with the ever increasing red tape that was stopping teachers actually teaching, she did not agree with my decision and went behind my back to put my son's name down for a local school. We were then invited to view the school and this visit made up my mind for me.

I had never actually taught my 3 year old anything formally (I just answered any questions he had) and after he told the reception class teacher that he knew the alphabet, made her listen to him count up to 500 in 5's and 10's, and then, when she showed us the internet resources they use, he informed her that he was already doing Reading Eggs, she took me to one side and gave me a right talking to, saying I should not have taught him anything as if he was learning a different way from how they did it, he would have to start from the beginning again and it would make it more difficult for him. She just would not believe me that he had learned it all himself from watching cbeebies and other preschool programs.

On the whole, everyone apart from my sister, has been very supportive. We've done lots of activities with the local home ed groups over the years, so much that he's often asked to have a few days off to have some quiet time. It has been hard too, I can't lie about that. I like quiet time myself but don't get much chance of it these days. I'm a single mum and, sadly, his dad never wanted to see him although this has improved a lot recently. We're also continually skint, as I'm only part-time self employed, so we don't get many treats but I know I've done the right thing for my son and if he wants to try school at any time, he knows he can.

[oldjerry]

OH works on an IT helpdesk and gets calls daily from teachers and headteachers, he is disgusted by their attitude and shocked at their incompetence!

I'm pretty keen on the idea of home educating,and ours(5,6and12) would have done it were they not fortunate enough to go to a couple of great schools,but I don't think you can make a good case for it by merely trashing all teachers with generalizations like that!

To be fair OJ, Penny Lane was referring to those people her OH receives calls from. Perhaps the ones with a good attitudes and a decent level of competence don't call? When I think about all the teachers I had at school, plus all the ones my son and my eldest daughter had, there are only a handful that I could say were good teachers. Some were abysmal. Most were mediocre.

We had a knock on the door the other day, totally unexpected, from an Education Welfare Officer. I wasn't in and my OH refused to let her in the house, telling her he wants me here before we discuss anything. She went away again and the next day we received a letter. It looked as if someone had taken a bag of commas and apostrophes and just thrown them at the pages, and the presentation was very poor. That's from the LEA! As if that isn't bad enough, the information leaflet they sent us "to help us", apart from telling us nothing other than what they WON'T help with, was written in a very threatening manner and contained quite a lot of false information. Needless to say, I have been fuming about it ever since.

It just seems to me that to justify home edding your kids on that sort of basis isn't so great. Doubtless there are some chronic teachers in the system(and many who are dedicated,knowledgable and a godsend to the education system) in the same way as there are some crap lawyers,some crap doctors,crap nurses and maybe,dare I say it,even the odd person who think they're doing a great job home educating their children who aint.

Christ,I know a couple of IT guys who wear their pants outside their trousers,but I'm sure they're a tiny minority.

[boboff]

Well I thought Wigan Pick posts was very well written,deserves to be acknowledged, and a supportive Well done Girl statement made!

Go and be grumpy somewhere else Jerry!

My attitude to schools is changing, I used to think they were ok, now not so.

My one observation of Pimary school is this, only the parents with children who are statemented park on the yellow lines or in driveways or in other non permitted places. Now this is just my observation at one school, is it true elsewhere I wonder? And which comes first i.e. child with needs and a statement makes the illegal parking acceptable, or parents who park illegally are genetically pre-disposed to have children with special needs? Sort of Which Comes first the Lazy cow who doesn't think rules apply to her, or the special needs of a child?

Hmmm

[oldjerry]

Go and be grumpy somewhere else Jerry!




My attitude to schools is changing, I used to think they were ok, now not so.

My one observation of Pimary school is this, only the parents with children who are statemented park on the yellow lines or in driveways or in other non permitted places. Now this is just my observation at one school, is it true elsewhere I wonder? And which comes first i.e. child with needs and a statement makes the illegal parking acceptable, or parents who park illegally are genetically pre-disposed to have children with special needs? Sort of Which Comes first the Lazy cow who doesn't think rules apply to her, or the special needs of a child?


POT,KETTLE and BLACK springs to mind!!!!...................Oh Well..You're all probably right.....

Hmmm

[boboff]

Indeed, I was only Joking!

[Pumpkin&Piglet]

I've not yet found anyone, except on here, that agrees with me that home schooling is a good idea but I can't wait to be doing it and I think sending your child off to spend the majority of their time without you is odd.

As parents its your main responsibility to care and teach for your children, not put the responsibility onto someone who has qualified by a means decided by someone who doesn't know me or my children or indeed probably knows anything about the individual situation most of the children are in.

Just because something is socially acceptable - and as popular as the schooling system is - doesn't' mean it's right for everyone.

Having said that - and I do believe it - I do realise the education system we have in place in this country is fantastic in many respects. Whatever it's flaws it's available to everyone regardless of race, sex, religion etc and while not every teacher is amazing there are some true exceptions who help children in a way no one else could. There are plenty or people in the world who unfortunately don't have the opportunity to experience this.

[wigan pixie]

Personally I think (and this is influenced by friends of mine who are teachers) that the government should stop interfering by imposing targets and dictating how teaching is done, leave it to the teachers to decide the best way to teach their pupils, not everyone learns in the same way but, because of class sizes and the number of required boxes to be ticked, teachers have to stick to the government approved way of teaching and form filling in, so very little time is spent with individual children and if any of the kids need a different teaching approach they just don't get what they need. This certainly isn't the teachers fault, they have to do what they are told but it certainly doesn't benefit the pupils. It makes me very sad, so many kids will not fulfill their potential because of a 'one size fits all' education system, schooling has certainly been dumbed down since I was there. My mate's son was getting his stuff ready for his home economics lesson and they were making cottage pie. The ingredients he had to take were a packet of Smash and a tin of minced beef with onion and gravy

[Rosendula]

It just seems to me that to justify home edding your kids on that sort of basis isn't so great. Doubtless there are some chronic teachers in the system(and many who are dedicated,knowledgable and a godsend to the education system) in the same way as there are some crap lawyers,some crap doctors,crap nurses and maybe,dare I say it,even the odd person who think they're doing a great job home educating their children who aint.

Christ,I know a couple of IT guys who wear their pants outside their trousers,but I'm sure they're a tiny minority.

I know what you mean. I've met a lot of people who are terrible at their jobs and many people who are good at their jobs. I've also had jobs myself that I have been terrible at, and a few I've been good at. Amongst the home edders I have met so far, I don't think I could honestly say any of them are really bad at home educating, though I do sometimes wonder if a few of them have a clue about parenting.

[mrsflibble]

My mate's son was getting his stuff ready for his home economics lesson and they were making cottage pie. The ingredients he had to take were a packet of Smash and a tin of minced beef with onion and gravy

o.O I'd refuse on principle! and also write a hefty letter citing the government's health guidelines for food served in school lol. you know, for one thing pointing out the red and orange "wheel of death" on the mince tin would be a start.

I once had to take in a" jar of pasta sauce and some quick cook pasta" to make an "italian dinner" (WTF?!). My sicilian-descended mum refused to let me. I was the only kid in the class to go in with home made tuna and sweetcorn ravioli and pot of home made parsley sauce (the most "British" italian food mum could think of), and I was also the only kid to get an A in that lesson.

[oldjerry]

But they aren't all like that.In the last4 months my 11 yr old has made pastry,scone-based pizza(insufficient time for a bread base to rise),and to be fair,they had her show them how to make a decent passata,(she's half Italian ,her nonna has an Italian restaurant,though her Cornish Dad still makes the best pizza!).
My 6 yr old came home last week with a self made cheesecake,and my 5 yr old son has had 6 weekly hour long cookery lessons after school this term.(interestingly,his 'disgusting and incompetant' teacher doesn't get paid for this- just thinks it's a worthwhile thing to do).

[Pumpkin&Piglet]

Personally I think (and this is influenced by friends of mine who are teachers) that the government should stop interfering by imposing targets and dictating how teaching is done, leave it to the teachers to decide the best way to teach their pupils, not everyone learns in the same way but, because of class sizes and the number of required boxes to be ticked, teachers have to stick to the government approved way of teaching and form filling in, so very little time is spent with individual children and if any of the kids need a different teaching approach they just don't get what they need. This certainly isn't the teachers fault, they have to do what they are told but it certainly doesn't benefit the pupils. It makes me very sad, so many kids will not fulfill their potential because of a 'one size fits all' education system, schooling has certainly been dumbed down since I was there. My mate's son was getting his stuff ready for his home economics lesson and they were making cottage pie. The ingredients he had to take were a packet of Smash and a tin of minced beef with onion and gravy

I do very much agree. It must also take out any motivation to do a good and worthwhile job when you are bombarded with rules and guidelines and arrogance from above.

[Penny Lane]

Thanks for sticking up for me Rosendula :)

Old Jerry - Of course not all teachers are like that and we are certainly not making decisions for our son's education based solely on my OH's experiences with teachers and headteachers in work. My own sister was a teacher and a good one at that! My comment was just an example, I gave other reasons as to why we wish to home educate and we have many more.
There have been so many excellent replies to this thread, all of which I agree with and don't need to repeat.

BTW - OH doesn't wear his pants outside his work trousers... As far as I know!!

EDIT, 'disgusting attitude' is what I said, not 'disgusting and incompetent'. By which I mean, demanding their needs be put before all others, no please or thank you's, shouting at children passing by them while on the phone, treating the IT staff like s***t and still expecting them to help and be polite. I'm sure your 5 year old's teacher is very good at her job and enjoys it, I'm sure there are a multitude of teachers who are good at their jobs. But there are also a great deal that really just don't give a stuff anymore. I should know, I was taught by a few!!

[oldjerry]

Yeah,apololgies all round.Actually,as I tried to point out,I'm personally rather in favour of home edding.I'm a bit touchy about attitudes but I'll not go into it now as Idon't want to hijack your thread,nor wrongly give the impression I'm getting at any one in this thread.So good luck to you and Best Wishes.

[boboff]

For my two penneth, Teachers are very quick to moan about targets and paperwork, when in reality it is a fundamental of all Jobs. Teachers get paid really well, and should be able to develop children they are teaching, it is afterall the job.
Teachers, SENCO's, Your Doctor, Childrens centres are all there to support the child and provide different forms of teaching and learning geared to the individual.
At our school we have the Area Resource Centre for Autistic Children. My son who has multiple learning difficulties has a one to one called toe by toe, he does fun fit first thing, they have a special circle of friends meeting, they have restreamed KS2 for phonics based on ability, he has had 8 or so special health shrink meet ups and self esteem councelling, a number of dedicated touch typing and IT lessons. Now I am not saying it's perfect, and in many ways it has relied on us as parents pushing every step of the way, but at the end of the day that is my job as a parent.

So contrary to what a couple of said, I see no evidence what so ever for a one size fits all education system, and indeed recent changes in OFSTED mean that this is NOT the case, targeting development in groups of 5 based on ability, and absolutely insisting on possitive progress in all ranges of ability.

Teachers don't like it, it means they can't just focus on the kids they like anymore, and actually have to Teach the ones that smell of wee.

[the.fee.fairy]

Personally I think (and this is influenced by friends of mine who are teachers) that the government should stop interfering by imposing targets and dictating how teaching is done, leave it to the teachers to decide the best way to teach their pupils, not everyone learns in the same way but, because of class sizes and the number of required boxes to be ticked, teachers have to stick to the government approved way of teaching and form filling in, so very little time is spent with individual children and if any of the kids need a different teaching approach they just don't get what they need. This certainly isn't the teachers fault, they have to do what they are told but it certainly doesn't benefit the pupils. It makes me very sad, so many kids will not fulfill their potential because of a 'one size fits all' education system, schooling has certainly been dumbed down since I was there. My mate's son was getting his stuff ready for his home economics lesson and they were making cottage pie. The ingredients he had to take were a packet of Smash and a tin of minced beef with onion and gravy

Oh if only there was a Like button!!

As a teacher, and knowing a lot of UK teachers too, I agree whole heartedly.

From what my friends in the UK tell me, their jobs are becoming more about ticking boxes than actually teaching. They would love to get down and involved, but they can't because of restrictions put upon them. They would love to sweep an upset young child into their arms and calm them down, but they're not allowed to touch them.

One of my friends is training to be a primary teacher and she has said that the biggest problem is that the children are all at different levels when they get there. Some parents teach their children things (like counting, the alphabet, writing their name, tying their shoelaces) before they get to school and others expect the school to do it, so the ones who have been taught previously get left out and bored while the teacher is trying to teach the others.

She also raised concerns about the amount of 'statemented' children - she wonders whether some of them are diagnosed with 'something' because either they lack the skills to behave, or they are far ahead of the others and cause disruption. I have to say, in my experience here, there are very very few 'statemented' students. I have one student who probably has ADHD, but he's told to behave in class. There is no special treatment. I asked the college about this, and they said that he had to learn to concentrate and behave because he wouldn't get special treatment in a job situation. This fits with what my friend in the UK said - How will these poor kids get on when they go to work if they're used to one to one teaching, assistants, extra time, extra classes etc.?

Whilst we both agree that there are probably a percentage of children who have some kind of special need, we both feel that a lot are being diagnosed needlessly just because they either learn differently, or are ahead of the class and get bored. Or they just have different behaviours. I'm pretty sure that i would have been diagnosed as autistic at school because I'm not really a social person, I'm not interested in interacting with others most of the time. I was the loner who sat in the corner with a book rather than running around the playground. However, I don't think that I am autistic, just using it as an example of the over-diagnoses going on. The problem with the over diagnoses is that there is a larger percentage of students now who 'need' extra help, or special treatment which means that the others get treated differently.

I remember being at school and having a boy sat next to me who needed an assistant (I'm not sure why, I never asked). She sat with him and had to explain everything the teacher said and then proceeded to give him the answers to any questions. This was ok...Until the woman kept prodding me and saying 'Are you ok, are you alright' when I was trying to work. Maybe it would be better to have the students who need help in a separate class. Then they and their assistants can work together without disturbing others, and they can get the one to one they need. This would also help the teacher in the other classes to teach their students in a different fashion because they don't have to make sure that the assistants are keeping up, or that the special needs students are feeling overwhelmed.

Sorry if this is a bit disjointed...not well today