A bit of advice needed....

[gazo31]

Hey guys,
my plot has been cleared of all the brambles except for the roots (there are thousands of them), I'm just wondering about how to get rid of the roots really should I:

1. Dig all the roots out by hand clearing the plot. Then Double Digging the plot to improve the drainage.

or

2. Double Dig the plot removing roots as I go along. Could I just turn over the roots and bury them in the Double Digging process?

Sounds daft i know but my plot is large 65ft by 53ft and the ground has not been worked for many years. Topsoil is excellent quality, subsoil is sandy in nature. Drainage to lower half of Plot is poor at the moment. I have an old well on site also which needs to be covered over ASAP to stop my little boy from exploring it. Any advice would be welcome.

Cheers all

A mistake is simply another way of doing things.

[boboff]

Really it's up to you. I would start on a manageable part. Have you considered raised beds? Use Manure then Compost, and you won't have to dig at all. You could then focus on sorting out the paths, and having a good go at the bits where you want to plant permanent stuff like soft fruit and Asparagus. Anything which you don't get round to just dig and plant spuds in the first year, it will get double dug then in any event. Get your hands on as much manure as you can and incorporate in any digging you do, especially if doing it at this time of year.

If it's really bad you may benefit from hiring a rotavator (longest palindrome in the dictionary)

[MKG]

WHATEVER you do, don't bury the bramble roots. Brambles can grow in outer space, I reckon. If there's a bit of root in there, no matter how deep, you will get little brambles springing up, and a little bramble grows into a big bramble VERY quickly. You have to dig 'em out (I once tried sodium chlorate, but the brambles virtually ignored it). Rotavating your plot with those roots still there will only make the problem worse. You can, with effort, clear a single bramble root. If that root is in thirty pieces and spread around a couple of cubic feet of soil, you're in trouble. Oh - and don't try to compost them, otherwise your compost heap turns into a bramble patch.

On the other hand, as Boboff says, you don't have to do it all at once. Clear a manageable patch and then enjoy your blackberries. Clear a bit more next year ...

Mike

[Green Aura]

Yup, you need to get rid of the bramble roots, and I suggest burning them if you're allowed fires, because you can't compost them. Pernicious little buggers, outrun only by horsetail - and maybe knotweed

Even if you cover them up, they'll either break through the barrier or wait until you uncover then go on a growing spree.

If you can put in deep raised beds, but bury them a little - if you see what I mean, it might help to keep out the brambles, but as they'll be growing in your paths, you'll soon find you can't get to the beds without a machete

OK maybe they're not that quick! But you get the picture?

[grahamhobbs]

If you can dig out all the bramble roots and... double dig your plot... I think we'll all have to have whip round to give you a prize - a holiday, you'll deserve it!

[pumpy]

As every-one has said....... bramble roots are a bugger to get rid of. Round these parts, if you have access to a pig, then let it loose on your patch......... they'll soon clear any roots!!

[Susie]

Oh no! I came here to post much the same question about bramble roots and I have read the answers and am worried

(in fact I thought bramble roots were the least of my problems since I also have bindweed, nettles, ground elder and no natural gardening ability!)

[MKG]

Hi Susie

It's nothing more to worry about than just brambles. Turn over a spadeful of soil, and all of those roots will be sitting there looking at you. It's a bit more picking up, but that's about all.

Nettles, though, you'll probably have to do several times. You can get all of the roots out, but you'll miss the seeds set at the end of this season, so they'll grow. Dig those out too - and whatever you do, don't let them seed again. Restrict them to the boundaries and you'll still have enough to make nettle beer or boil up a handful or two of leaves to go with the Sunday roast.

Mike

[Millymollymandy]

And don't panic too much! You won't get everything out the first year (bindweed you'll never get all of it out!) but as a veg patch is essentially a bed of annuals it's something you can dig over every year and remove more roots. As time goes by you will have fewer weeds apart from the ones that self seed but these can be hoed off.

However if you are planting any perennials then I'd work that patch really well, but any brambles or other weeds that do come up can be ripped or hoed off as soon as they appear and eventually (hopefully, theoretically ) they will weaken in time.

Good luck!

[gazo31]

Thanks for the advice guys.

I've just got myself 3 Adazes from the http://www.get-digging.co.uk/ website. If you've not seen these tools before have a look they are really excellent (take a bit to get used to) but they are really great at ripping out those Bramble roots and Blindweed. I think they are also called Chillington or Canterbury Hoes as well (but I'm not sure). So it looks like I'm going to be ripping up Brambles at the weekend. (actually it's very theraputic!)

Thanks again for the tips.

[Cheezy]

My advice

1.Take your time and enjoy yourself. If you double dig and hand remove as much root then all the better you'll reap the rewards later.

2. Cover any area your not working on, to stop weeds coming . We've been gradually working our way down our plot towards the area that was infested with brambles, marestail, docks and couchgrass 3 years ago. This is the last 4 x 3 m bit that I've been putting off, but had it covered with some black weed suppressant for 2 years. Now I'm actually doing it, it's turned out the easiest, since 99% of all the roots have rotted....only the brambles remain!.

3. Once you've double dug no doubt you'll have turned over some weed seeds that have been dormant for years, so if your not going to sow anything into it immediately, cover this. If you use black weed suppressant this has the added bonus of warming the soil earlier in Spring.

4. If using black weed suppressant make sure it's the woven stuff, this allows water in and the soil to breath. It is expensive so you could use carpet (there are some doubts about its green cred with all the chemicals in it), and it's a pain to remove once it's old stinky and wet. Or you could try putting a layer of thick cardboard with top soil/mulch onto to weight it down. This will suppress the weeds for a while, and eventually rot down into the soil adding some organic matter. You can also plant through this.

5. Where your soil has poor drainage then I would recommend raised beds. I use them since I am at the bottom of a hill and all ours flood in heavy rain. There is nothing so dishearting than turning up to find your plot under water and all your stuff distroyed. I have never suffered from this where I have used raised beds, and I'm amazed that all my neighbours havent done anything about it , but still grumble about the problem, as it has happend for the last three years running.

You have the added bonus that if you have double dug, then made raised beds, you can switch to a no dig policy there after, since you should not be standing on the soil. I just loosly break up the top, before adding compost/muck/etc.
Also In the very wet weather you can still potter about around the beds weeding, adding mulch and planting hardy stuff while everyone else is complaining its too wet to get out!.

[Flo]

( no natural gardening ability!)

Gardening is something you learn like lessons at school but in a far more pleasant way and without the pressure - ask the questions, learn the basics and practice. You'll get there.

[Susie]

Thanks for that, everybody, that is really helpful. I'm going to dig up as much as I can before I start planting next spring, and then I will try and wear the rest of them down slowly in a Me v Weeds war of attrition. I swear some of these roots go down to the centre of the earth! (we have ivy as well and if I take my eye off it it tries to grow into the house.)

I can't tell you how excited I am at the prospect of a vegetable patch (I have pics on my blog if you want to see what I am working with - it still looks a bit crap but it is starting to look better.)

[Millymollymandy]

I just noticed yesterday when hoeing my veg patch that I have a new perennial weed starting to infest the veg patch - it's the hawkbit that I have (and hate!) in my lawn - has a fleshy and presumably deep tap root. Stupid me removed a load of them in the spring and put the in the compost (not the roots just the rosette of green leaves) so they've just grown back in the lawn anyway - so probably hoeing isn't going to help long term.

I think the ones in my veg patch must have come in by seed though as I obviously haven't used the compost yet but in future I think I'll be sending them to the tip along with the bindweed roots etc. It never stops!

[Millymollymandy]

I can't tell you how excited I am at the prospect of a vegetable patch (I have pics on my blog if you want to see what I am working with - it still looks a bit crap but it is starting to look better.)

It's not crap and looks amazing compared to the before photo good luck to you with it for next year!