Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

You all seem to be such proficient chefs. Well here is a place to share some of that cooking knowledge. Or do you have a cooking problem? Ask away. Jams and chutneys go here too.
grahamhobbs
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Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258780Post grahamhobbs »

Sometime ago I promised to report back on bottling meat after being in France, having been involved in the killing and butchering of a pig done in the completely traditional annual way.

Basically the meat was put into clean (not sterilised) Kilner type jars, the jars covered with water and brought to the boil. If the meat was uncooked it was boiled for 3 hours, 1 hour if the meat was already cooked. The temperature was between 90 and 95degC. The meat will keep for several years.

I also learnt the best way to preserve fruit, such as pears, plums and apples, in jars is to peel, core and halve the ripe fruit, put them in jars without water or sugar, and as above boil for 30 mins.
Last edited by grahamhobbs on Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258785Post demi »

yes, water bath bottling!
this is what we do too.
except i havent done it with meat but iv been told its possible.

now prepare yourself for people freaking out about botulism!

wait for it......wait for it...... :lol:


its funny how its only people in the UK and the US ect, where nobody does this, that are making a big hoohaa about it.
else where in the world where water bath preserving is the norm, nobody bats an eyelid over it. :dontknow:
my in-laws tell me they have been doing it like this every year for generations, same as every other family in this region and across the world, and they've never heard of anyone getting botulism.
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then morally guess what your off the hook, and thank Christ you only have to read one book'

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258815Post The Riff-Raff Element »

demi wrote:
now prepare yourself for people freaking out about botulism!

wait for it......wait for it...... :lol:


its funny how its only people in the UK and the US ect, where nobody does this, that are making a big hoohaa about it.
else where in the world where water bath preserving is the norm, nobody bats an eyelid over it. :dontknow:
my in-laws tell me they have been doing it like this every year for generations, same as every other family in this region and across the world, and they've never heard of anyone getting botulism.
For someone who's got such faith in science you do have some funny ideas. Why you cannot simply accept that there is a small, but nonetheless present, risk of poisoning in this approach is beyond me. In fact, you seem to be the one making all the fuss.

In France we have a few cases every year, almost always from people eating home preserved stuff that is not reheated before eating. Last year it was some goose liver pâté that got a few, the year before that it was bottled wild mushrooms.

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258816Post The Riff-Raff Element »

grahamhobbs wrote:
Basically the meat was put into clean (not sterilised) jars, covered with water and brought to the boil. If the meat was uncooked it was boiled for 3 hours, 1 hour if the meat was already cooked. The temperature was between 90 and 95degC. The meat will keep for several years.
Which region were you in Graham? Around here the interest is more in hams and raw curing of sausage. If stuff is put into jars the medium is more usually lard than water - rillettes and that sort of thing. I think brine may be used elsewhere (Nord Pas de Calais, for example), but I've not heard of it around here.

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258846Post demi »

The Riff-Raff Element wrote:
For someone who's got such faith in science you do have some funny ideas. Why you cannot simply accept that there is a small, but nonetheless present, risk of poisoning in this approach is beyond me. In fact, you seem to be the one making all the fuss.

In France we have a few cases every year, almost always from people eating home preserved stuff that is not reheated before eating. Last year it was some goose liver pâté that got a few, the year before that it was bottled wild mushrooms.

yes there is a risk. i accept it. and i dont eat anything thats not been re-heated properly. all of the jars of veg we have are used in cooking, for sauce ect.
but it seems from doing some reading and talking to people that as long as the food is boiled before eating it destroys the toxins and makes the food safe to eat. but still people in the UK ect dont want to preserve in this way. :dontknow: which is a real shame as its the perfect way of preserving summer veg for winter use. we would just be living off potatoes and cabbages in the winter here without it!
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then morally guess what your off the hook, and thank Christ you only have to read one book'

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258853Post grahamhobbs »

The Riff-Raff Element wrote:
grahamhobbs wrote:
Basically the meat was put into clean (not sterilised) jars, covered with water and brought to the boil. If the meat was uncooked it was boiled for 3 hours, 1 hour if the meat was already cooked. The temperature was between 90 and 95degC. The meat will keep for several years.
Which region were you in Graham? Around here the interest is more in hams and raw curing of sausage. If stuff is put into jars the medium is more usually lard than water - rillettes and that sort of thing. I think brine may be used elsewhere (Nord Pas de Calais, for example), but I've not heard of it around here.
I was in the Touraine and we made mainly rillettes, pate and roti to go in jars. Sorry perhaps I wasn't clear, the jars were covered with water, not the meat in the jars. We did also make saussisons a l'ail, boudin, and andoullet.

I asked whether anyone in the Touraine makes hams and dry cured sausages, they said it was rare these days because no one has fires going all the time.

Riff-Raff, do you know how the details of making the raw cured sausages. Not being a great meat eater, but having gone through the whole process I am now very interested in the process of charcuterie.

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258856Post oldjerry »

Hi Graham,I was hoping you'd post when you got back,don't know if you've got it,but Maynard's book is very good for charcuterie.
I'm still not 100% clear on the process,you stick the meat,etc uncooked in say a kilner with the screw lid on (tight?),then boil for 3 hrs...or am I losing it?..

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258862Post MKG »

BOTULISM!!!



Don't Panic, Captain Mainwaring!!



:blob: :confused2: :sad3:

:pukeleft: :pukeleft: :pukeleft:

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258863Post grahamhobbs »

Hi Oldjerry, basically the meat is put into kilner type jars, either pre-cooked or uncooked. With pate and rillettes the meat has already been cooked, but with chunks of meat, that you might otherwise roast for instance, it can go in uncooked. If using clip type jars, you put the rubber seals on and clip down the lid. With screw top jars, the seals go on and the lids screwed down but released slightly (I used to use these but it is a few years back now, so can't remember exactly how much back you turn them, I think it is 1/2 a turn, to allow air out but not water in).

The size of jar depends on what you are preserving, say 250cc for pate, up to 1 litre for the chunks of meat.

The jars are then stacked in a large metal pan, this needs to be big to be able to submerge the jars and for the water to boil. Obviously the more jars you have the bigger the pan needs to be. In France large pans specifically for this use are readily available and can come with thermometers sticking out of the lid. These are normally used over gas burners, again made for the job, using bottled gas. We actually did a lot of our cooking on a traditional cast iron cauldron with a wood fire underneath (incredibly efficient). If you pick one of these up in a french boot sale it would be great investment.

Books recommend that the jars don't touch the sides or bottom or each other, either using a purpose made wire cage between them or to use rags between. This seems unnecessary so long as nothing can move, the jars must be very firmly held in place, no slight rattles, using rags and largish flat stones. Also weighing them down with rags and stones on top.

Then the water is brought to the boil and boiled for the time specified, 1 hour for cooked meat and 3 hour for uncooked. The whole thing is then left to cool naturally before lifting everything out.

The following day the jars can be tested that they have sealed properly by undoing the clips and testing if the vacuum holds the lid secure.

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258864Post oldjerry »

Thanks Graham,that's what I was thinking. Don't forget the Maynard it's still available(but a bit pricy).Thanks again.BW.

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258870Post The Riff-Raff Element »

grahamhobbs wrote:
Riff-Raff, do you know how the details of making the raw cured sausages. Not being a great meat eater, but having gone through the whole process I am now very interested in the process of charcuterie.
I make a sizable batch of chorizo every autumn, but I just cure it in a cool draughty place undercover outside. I can detail the recipe, if you like.

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258872Post grahamhobbs »

Riff-Raff, thanks I am interested. Is there anything special you have to do for the meat to be preserved eg. salt or is it just the drying process in plenty of air?

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258898Post demi »

The Riff-Raff Element wrote:
grahamhobbs wrote:
Riff-Raff, do you know how the details of making the raw cured sausages. Not being a great meat eater, but having gone through the whole process I am now very interested in the process of charcuterie.
I make a sizable batch of chorizo every autumn, but I just cure it in a cool draughty place undercover outside. I can detail the recipe, if you like.

id also like to know your recipe for chorizo or other spicy smoked sausage like pepperoni ect.
we will be getting a pig at the end of the summer and id love to make my own, preferably with less fat if thats possible?
the smoked sausage here is FULL of fat and grizzly bits which i hate eating! :pukeright:
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'If you just close your eyes and block your ears, to the acumulated knowlage of the last 2000 years,
then morally guess what your off the hook, and thank Christ you only have to read one book'

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258901Post The Riff-Raff Element »

OK - my chorizo remains a work in progress, but here is the latest incarnation, which is based on 2 kg meat, or multiples thereof. Frankly, the potential for food poisoning (including, but not limited to, botulism :lol: - actually, that is the least of your worries :pale: ) is pretty alarming with raw meat products, so follow these instructions if you wish, but I take no responsibility, and so on and so forth.

Your 2 kg of meat should be preferably be made up of 80% lean pork plus 20% back fat chopped into a fine dice about the size of half a dried pea. Good quality sausage meat will be a fine substitute.

To this you should add:

40g sea salt (to which a pinch of saltpetre should be added if you want a nice pinkish colour, though this is not essential and can be hard to find in some countries - it's potassium nitrate which is a component of gunpowder: you could try asking for Prague Powder which is salt with saltpetre added);
A good heaped table spoon of smoked paprika;
Two crushed garlic gloves;
5g fresh milled black pepper (this can take a while);
The contents of a couple of acidophilus capsules;
About 250ml of sturdy red wind (think Rioja)

Once well mixed, put into pig casings and cut off at about 30/40 cm long. Traditionally, chorizo were formed into loops, but I just hang mine from one end from hooks so that they do not touch one another. I make a tent of fine muslin to protect them from any late flies and hang them under cover in a nice draughty place. A temperature of less then 15°C but above freezing is needed. I start mine in early November and hang until mid December.

The chorizo become covered in mould. This is supposed to happen. Only worry if it is black mould. All other colours are OK - the acidophilus multiples and spreads through the meat, keeping the pH low and the nasty stuff at bay. After six weeks, I rub the mould off with newspaper, then roll the chorizos in the purist wood ash (it must be hardwood), then wrap in grease proof paper and store somewhere cool. This stops them going too hard.

For books, can I recommend Jane Grigson on "Charcuterie & French Pork Cookery?"

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Re: Bottling (Canning) meat and other things

Post: # 258928Post grahamhobbs »

Thanks Riff-Raff, the recipe is very similar to the garlic sausage we made without the red wine, paprika and acidphilus but adding 4 spice. However ours were cooked very carefully at 85degC for 25 minutes, then hung to dry in loops.
Do you have any difficulty in buying the pig intestine for the skins?

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