Interesting News from Holland

[oldfella]

It appears that the Dutch comsumer watchdog , is to press their Government to take up the question of the Sell By Date on food stuffs including vegetables, with the EU, as in their view throwing away, 90 billion Euros, worth of perfectly good foodstuff is "Unsustainable"
They have carried out tests on various canned foods and preserves, and also dried goods and have come to the conclusion that The EU should investigate the matter and amend the law.
It would appear that Supermarket chains have been SUGGESTING that the producers, should cut back their sell by dates.
It would appear that they have been investigating this matter for some months and have come to the conclusion that there is grounds for a full investigation into the matter.

[okra]

Although some people avidly stick to use by dates or best before dates, most people I think, including ourselves, are happily ignoring the advice anyway. Do others carry on using food or chuck it out on the suggested date?

[sammyh]

Sniff it and see, always been my motto! My dad always said gone off milk was yoghurt! never quite convinced us kids!!

I'm careful with meat, but I do think alot of food wastage is down to the lack of planning people do food wise- and the amount they buy. If I do a big supermarket shop, I'm far more likely to have things lurking about past the sell by date. But mostly I'm just too damm tight to throw food away!!


sam

[okra]

I think the use of best before and use by dates are not understood by many. Use by is for perishable food but best before is for goods where the quality will deteriorate but not become bad for health.

Before labelling was introduced to the UK in 1980, consumers relied on their senses to tell them whether food had gone off. There would probably be a lot less food wasted if we returned to using our senses.

[oldjerry]

Supermarkets LOVE sell by dates.However great a glutton you may be, there will always be a limit to how much food you can eat.There's NO limit to how much you can chuck away.

[bill1953]

Sniff it and see, always been my motto! My dad always said gone off milk was yoghurt! never quite convinced us kids!!

I'm careful with meat, but I do think alot of food wastage is down to the lack of planning people do food wise- and the amount they buy. If I do a big supermarket shop, I'm far more likely to have things lurking about past the sell by date. But mostly I'm just too damm tight to throw food away!!


sam

Quite agree. Never believed that cheese with a date of say 12/03/12 is poisonous on the 13/03/2012. Years ago I worked in a supermarket and we dumped tons of 'out of date' stuff in huge bins. Didn't stay there long, it was gone by the morning and the bins never needed emptying.

The only thing I am wary of is meat and fish, especially shellfish. Whiskey is not a problem I have found

[battybird]

It always amuses me when you see the use by date on things like dried and pickled foods and vinegar! I always thought that they are "preserved"? Interestingly, I just looked at the various bottles of alcohol in the cupboard and only Malibu had a date (don't ask...2009!!), the brandy and dregs of other Xmas drink has no date! The waste of food is ridiculous and I am glad if it is going to be investigated, especially if the supermarkets are pushing for shorter dates. Now that would not be to do with profits would it??? Best before, use by and sell by dates are confusing to many people (my mum for one!) and I do use my nose and common sense like others in this forum! I hate throwing food away, we would be horrified if asked to throw the equivelant amount of cash in the bin!

[The Riff-Raff Element]

Supermarkets LOVE sell by dates.However great a glutton you may be, there will always be a limit to how much food you can eat.There's NO limit to how much you can chuck away.

No-one could ever be that morally bankrupt could they? Oh, hang on...

The whole best before date thing with stuff like honey, sugar & vinegar is quite amusing, but I notice they haven't progressed to salt yet, at least not here. I suspect even the most empty-headed shopper might question that one.

[Odsox]

Oh bugger you Susie, because of you I just looked at our sea salt container and the best before is 03/06/03
Now not only do I have to chuck what's left away, I shall spend a sleepless night worrying about how many people I have poisoned over the last 9 years.

[okra]

Oh bugger you Susie, because of you I just looked at our sea salt container and the best before is 03/06/03
Now not only do I have to chuck what's left away, I shall spend a sleepless night worrying about how many people I have poisoned over the last 9 years.

Ditto - catering size pack of tumeric with a use by date of 2007 still being used but we will probably continue using it as it's nearly finished.

[boboff]

Hmmmm

Supermarkets love use by dates?

Supermarkets wish to pay the supplier for the goods and then ditch it, without making a sale and loosing money?

Why not just make a statement without any basis in logic? Oh you already did!

Trading Standards are active in the use of Use by/Best Before Dates, suppliers have to retain samples of every production run until the use by date and then test it organaleptically and send for micro analysis for target pathogens.

Where products are seasonal, shorter shelf lives can be chosen to encourage store managers not to hoard last years stock, as allot of time and effort goes into shelf design and display on a season by season basis.

Again Trading Standards do not consider the "sniff it" test a sufficient due dillagence defence against someone getting food poisoning. Go figure.

The term Use by, is the only indicator of actual possibility of food poisoning, Best Before is what both your Salt and Turmeric will say, not Use by, and who is to argue with that? The product is best if you use it before that date, it's not going to hurt you if you use it after it.

So in summary, the Red Tape boys enforce this, suppliers take it seriously and retain samples for analysis, the longer the dates the bigger there warehouses to store samples become, read use by dates seriously, it means bacteria are in the product, and will grow and may make the food go off, or poison you, learn to read the difference between the terms "use by" and "best before"

The amorphous group "SUPERMARKETS" don't love Use by dates, they are legal obliged to take them seriously, as selling something which is out of date can result in them getting fined.

The cheese thing I am not sure about, also veg and salad dates confuse me a bit, I think the cheese thing is bacteria grow and stop pathogens growing, and you have to assume that people do not follow storage instructions, but I do agree we shouldn't waste food. I don't throw any away. This however is not the Supermarkets, it's the EU or food police who set this, and from a very risk averse basis, as if you get it wrong a product recall from a Supermarket will cost a minimum £100,000, plus any fines or loss of profits.

[oldjerry]

Boboff you and I have danced this Supermarket thing enough times to know we aint going to agree!

But I do like the notion that the SMs are just poor innocent players in this game,constantly pushed around by Food Companies,Trading Standards,Govt.etc.etc. with no more power to influence outcomes than you or me.

[boboff]

Their only guilt is in giving people what they want to make money.........

[okra]

Boboff - agree that we should stick to use by date items, given that possible food poisoning could be the result of ignoring the date but the expiry of a use by date is not hazardous to health. Many people rigidly stick to both dates and do not differentiate between the two and the result is huge mountains of food wasted.

The Government has proposed reforms to make labels clearer to differentiate between harmful and a mere gradual reduction in quality but the supermarkets are against changes. I wonder why, could it be that if people threw less away it would affect their profits.

[boboff]

Ummmm, who says they are against changes? How would it affect there profits? They stand to gain as much by reducing the amount they waste surely?

No keep knocking this group called Supermarkers, which include a Co-operative owned my the members (shoppers) a Co-operative owned by the staff, a US division, and the biggest private employer in the UK, add in the Billions of taxes paid, taxes administred, and support for regional food producers, and thats right NASTY people becuase they don't fit in with our perception of the good old days and left wing Anti everything brigade.

I didn't say stick to use by dates, but they are there for the thickies who think that if you buy some fish, leave it in the cupboard for a week and wonder why it gives you the shits and tastes of nappies, and want to sue everyone for there stupidity.

I used to do a daily taste panel on Smoked Salmon at end of Shelf life, and some of it wasn't pleasant, and had micro counts in the 10x7, how you wouldn't know it was off is beyond me, but up to about 10x6 taste wasn't affected, and could....could give you some symptoms if you are not that tollerant.

If people see "best before" and still type Use by, is it any wonder a "simpler" system could help?

Food waste in the home is caused by laziness and poor imagination in cooking, over buying, lack of planning, and other un-forseeable things, sometimes. It is an indication at best of our societies lack of time in the home, and poor education in Home Economics, it is not, and can never be because some group of shop keepers are encouraging us to throw stuff away and buy more, it just isn't.

I appreciate I, like you are, am stating my Opinions as facts, and for that I apologise, but hope that the reasoned arguements I have put to counter your assertions hold some sway, but somehow I doubt it, and as for OldJerry, I do know you can get some nice lefty hippies!

I came across the term Patriarcal Oppression the other day, that made as much sence!