vegtable oil and diesel engines

[paradox]

I have heared of people running diesel cars on vegtable oil and ive been thinking of sourcing a small second hand diesel engine to run on used vegtable oil to drive a car alternator which in turn would charge a bank of leisure batterys which could then power an inverter.

The two questions i have is what has a small diesel engine that would be suitable for use as a generator and what modifications are needed to make it run on used veg oil?

[Stonehead]

An old Lister is a good choice. Slow running, maintenance is straight forward, parts are still available and they were designed to run alternators among other things.

I have a Lister Start-o-matic (5hp) with a 2.5kw alternator. It's been converted to manual start and I haven't got it all connected yet, but it runs well on WVO. The main thing you need to do for maximum efficiency is pre-heat the oil just before it's injected. (You also need to stand the oil for some time for the water to settle, then filter out the gunge.)

I also have a Lister LD running a water pump. It also runs on WVO, but I haven't got around to fitting a pre-heater yet so it will coke up over time. Still, it does run well.

I've put a few posts on my blog about the Listers (but nowhere near enough!):

Thar she blows!
Running a Lister LD on vegetable oil
Running a Lister on WVO

There are some useful comments from Lister users as well.

[Muddypause]

If you want to pull one out of a car, then something like a Peugeot 106, or a Vauxhall Nova. I have a feeling it's the same engine in both of those - pretty small as cars go, but probably still a bit of overkill if you just want to charge up a few batteries.

I wouldn't claim to be an expert on biofuels, but I have browsed around the subject a bit, and know people who use the stuff. There seem to be two ways to go - turning the stuff into biodiesel, or running on pure vegetable oil. Either way, waste oil will need to be filtered, and separated from any water in it. Or you can buy it straight off the shelf of you favourite superstore.

Turning vegetable oil into biodiesel involves a process called transesterification - there is s recipe for it here. The end result is, I gather, equivalent to mineral diesel in terms of how your engine will behave.

Using SVO seems to be a more of a mixed bag. Some people seem very enthusiastic about it, but others seem to have been stung by engine damage. Some people claim to be able to use it without any engine modifications, others say you need to adapt the engine a little. The main issue seems to involve the fuel pump, which depends upon the fuel passing through it for lubrication. As the pump in a diesel engine is a high pressure one, this can be critical. There may also be issues with rubber seals and pipes that swell or degrade under VO.

I'd advise doing a good deal of research first; there are loads of biodiesel and veg-fuel forums on the net.

[Stonehead]

Using SVO seems to be a more of a mixed bag. Some people seem very enthusiastic about it, but others seem to have been stung by engine damage. Some people claim to be able to use it without any engine modifications, others say you need to adapt the engine a little. The main issue seems to involve the fuel pump, which depends upon the fuel passing through it for lubrication. As the pump in a diesel engine is a high pressure one, this can be critical. There may also be issues with rubber seals and pipes that swell or degrade under VO.

That's why I'm sticking to Listers - old tech, tough as old boots, easy to repair, designed to run on low quality fuels and handle a certain amount of abuse (although I wouldn't recommend the latter). You still need to look after them, but the old Listers are far more tolerant of WVO and SVO than most modern diesels. They're also a lot less stressed under load - and I love the sound they make.

Oh, you can get Indian re-makes/clones of Listers but be very, very wary. There are, apparently, a few good ones out there but I've heard too many scare stories abotu dodgy ones.

The fuel pump issue is down to the type of pump, but that will have to wait for another day as the OH is calling to ask if I really am going to drive the truck into town with her and boys...

[paradox]

An old Lister is a good choice. Slow running, maintenance is straight forward, parts are still available and they were designed to run alternators among other things.

I have a Lister Start-o-matic (5hp) with a 2.5kw alternator. It's been converted to manual start and I haven't got it all connected yet, but it runs well on WVO. The main thing you need to do for maximum efficiency is pre-heat the oil just before it's injected. (You also need to stand the oil for some time for the water to settle, then filter out the gunge.)

I also have a Lister LD running a water pump. It also runs on WVO, but I haven't got around to fitting a pre-heater yet so it will coke up over time. Still, it does run well.

I've put a few posts on my blog about the Listers (but nowhere near enough!):

Thar she blows!
Running a Lister LD on vegetable oil
Running a Lister on WVO

There are some useful comments from Lister users as well.

Hi stonehead thanks for your reply and ive taken a look at the links you gave me and i must say they make very encouraging reading.

Where would i source a second hand lister engine?

[Stonehead]

[Where would i source a second hand lister engine?

Ebay is a good starting point but be aware that Listers fetch far more in England (and especially from the Midlands southwards) than they do in Scotland. You're up against collectors and restorers as well as green power enthusiasts.

Farm dispersal sales are a good bet, but again the further they are from towns and cities the cheaper they'll be. Also, the last engines to be sold on auction day are invariably the cheapest as everyone has spent their money. (My Lister LD cost £40 as it was the second last one to be sold at a dispersal - it was also one of only two runners out of 40, but by the time the auctioneer got to it there was almost no interest.)

Free ad newspapers covering rural areas are also a good source, but make sure you scan the whole paper. Most of the time, Listers are to be found under agriculture or industrial, but they do pop up elsewhere.

Make sure you're buying a diesel Lister and not one of the many petrol ones.