My fire is not pumping out alot of heat, can you help??

[Satori]

Hi peepz,

I've just recently moved into a new property (rented) and it has a wood/coal fire in the living room which is not pumping out alot of heat.

I've taken out the grates at the bottom of the fire so we could get a bed of wood ash built up, which we thought might be the cause of the lack of heat coming from it, however this hasn't made much difference.

Here is a pic of the fire in question ... http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i131/ ... urFire.jpg .... and it is an old style Arrow Hamlet, which they don't make anymore as far as I can tell.

As you can hopefully tell from the pic, the fire is about 75% recessed into the chimney bloc ... so would this mean that 75% of the heat just gets absorbed by the chimney? ... I can't tell if the fire itself has any fire brics, but a friend who has a little knowledge about fires doesn't seem to think it does!

Anyhoo, we've had it roaring for 3-4 hours and it is still only slightly warm in the living room, so we've been thinking about asking the landlord if they'll go halves with us for a proper stove, one that would sit out of the chimney bloc itself so all the heat would radiator into the room and not the walls ...well thats the theory anyway!

Sorry about the long post peepz, but my partner and I are thinking about moving if we cannot solve this little problem, as it has been very cold recently, and we only have a small rayburn in the kitchen and no heating upstairs either, so this little fire in the living room would make a difference to our comfort levels and eventually, whether we stay or move somewhere else!!

Thanks in advance for any advice!

Satori

[Martin]

put the grates back in quick!
It looks like a properly designed stove - they usually make the exiting smoke take a circuitous route through the stove to escape - which should warm the stove up, which then radiates and convects the heat into the room. Although it's not exactly rocket science, they are designed to work with the grate, using it without has probably totally stuffed the proper airflow path through the stove. I'd suggest a jolly good clean out, get rid off all the ash, bung the grates back in, and relight it - it'll burn loads better, and will heat the room up as it should!

[Martin]

ps, a thought occurred - while you were stripping bits out, you didn't remove a plate in the top of the stove did you? - if so, bung that back in too - it's what forces the hot air through the structure of the stove to make it hot - without it, most of the heat hurtles straight up the chimney!
-they are also designed to be run with the stove doors CLOSED!

[Satori]

Hi Martin,

Thanks for the quick replies!

Nope, didn't remove the plate at the top of the stove, it's still there!

Just a note, I did try a couple of fires with the grate still in, however, they were'nt very good/didn't pumped out alot of heat and made me think that it was just a coal fire ... also, once the wood had burnt down to small embers it fell through the grate which made it hard to keep going! .. which is what made me think that it was just a coal fire, and caused me to remove the grate, and just use the tray to build up a bed of ash and use it for wood instead.

[Martin]

in that case, I reckon it's poor airflow - clean it out, bung the grates back in, make sure the vent is fully open (the grille at the bottom of the stove), and then light it, then keep the doors closed unless filling it. The door "windows" look very smoky, if you can get a good burn going, it should burn most of that off - then when it's really going like a train, shut the grille down a bit to adjust the level. Good luck, there's few things more miserable than being cold and damp!

[Muddypause]

Masonary takes a while to warm up. This will be particularly true if the property has not been lived in for a while.

In a way you are right about the chimney block absorbing the heat; this will also be true for the whole of the fabric of the building. Think of it as thermal mass it is not really lost heat, and once it has warmed up a little, it will help to stabalise the temperature of the house.

I'd give the fire a couple of days before condeming it.

Also remember that some wood will give out more heat than other. Cheap pine is plentiful, but does not contain a great deal of heat value. IIRC, ash and birch, amongst other hardwoods, are good for burning.

[red]

have to say I don't agree with alot of what Martin advises (no offence!)

the grate is there for when you are burning coal. take it out if you mostly burn wood. a good bed of ash is essential - only remove some when it gets to the point of being annoying. The blackened windows should not effect the heat it gives out, only the ability to see the pretty fire.
Take a look athe rope seal around the door - does it look in good shape or not? is the air controlled only but the fron vent, or are there side controls too? When you get a fire going - do you damp the air down or leav it open? You are burning with the door shut? is there a back boiler of any kind? how big is the room you are trying to heat, and is it draft free etc? is that a yeoman stove? if not what make? could be worth emailing the manufacturer for advice.
and lastly - I am always saying this.. but it is worth getting a sweep around - one that does woodburners.. for advice.. for not much cash you can get the opinion of someone not trying to sell you a new burner....

[Martin]

the reason I gave the advice that I did is because over the years I have wrestled with a great many fires and stoves - what he has there looks like a multifuel stove (coal or logs), and IS designed to run all the time with the grate in place, (and the doors closed).............
The air enters through the grille at the front - goes underneath the grate, and up into the fire itself, where the oxygen in the air helps the fire to burn properly - the hot gases then come forwards towards the doors, and over a plate that runs fore and aft in the fire, taking the fumes back across the top of the stove, and thence up the chimney - warming the structure of the stove as it does so. If you look closely at the photograph, it shows clear evidence of not having achieved a good burning temperature because of the sooty deposits on the "windows" - if you then notice that the grille looks firmly shut............
We know that he's taken the grates out, and allowed a big build-up of ash, which has effectively stifled the proper intake of air...............
ps, as yet, we don't sell woodburners!

[Boots]

I thought Satori was a gal...

That aside... I don't use my fire much, so don't consider myself too knowledgeable really... but I did learn recently (like...last cold snap) that if I closed the thing pretty much right up on lighting (the chimney and side bits), the stove then absorbs a heck more heat and seems to heat the room up better. For ages, I kept thinking I was supposed to be sitting near on top of it! And I kept thinking it was a pretty sad stove... then I kinda got the hang of lighting it and when to open the bits and now it works. Funny that...

Every time I use it though, which is very few and far between... the window gets sooty... and it also took me a while to realise I can wipe it and watch the orange glow dance about. It was black when I got it, and I didn't even realise there was a window there for a while.

[red]

the reason I gave the advice that I did is because over the years I have wrestled with a great many fires and stoves - what he has there looks like a multifuel stove (coal or logs), and IS designed to run all the time with the grate in place,

The woodburner I had for years was also a multifuel stove. the advice is to keep the grill in if you use both kinds of fuel regularly, however, the manufacturers instructions on my stove told us to remove the grill if we were only burning logs. and we were. and we did not notice this advice at first so left the grill in. only when the chimney sweep remarked on it did we check, them remove the grill and found we were getting up to stick another log on far far less.. ie it was much more efficient without the grill.

The air enters through the grille at the front

and also in the side vents if your stove is designed as such.

In my experience all stoves end up with blackened windows even with the best intentions and best fuels and best air flow systems... the fact that a secondhand stove has blackened glass might only mean the previous owner never cleaned it.

-We know that he's taken the grates out, and allowed a big build-up of ash, which has effectively stifled the proper intake of air..............

yet if you are burning wood - it burns much better, much more efficiently on a bed of ash, with air coming in from the sides, and not from beneath..

[red]

. and it is an old style Arrow Hamlet, which they don't make anymore as far as I can tell.

oh sorry - I did not notice this first time round. the name is actually Aarrow hamlet - from aarrow stoves - dunno if this helps.